Tag: joists

Basement Ceiling Painting

March 17, 2016 / Matt / 0 Comments

We’re planning to live in the basement while we finish the other two main floors of the house at the same time. Eventually we plan to put insulation between the joists and install a drop ceiling in the basement. We also plan to insulate and drywall the exterior walls. However, because we know there will be ongoing work to run electrical, plumbing, and HVAC to the other floors, plus we’re putting in a couple of temporary walls for bedrooms, we can’t really put that in yet. At the same time, we don’t want to have the dark exposed joists and subfloor for a ceiling while we’re living in the basement. The solution is to paint the joists and the underside of the subfloor. There are other reasons to do this as well. We used a sealing primer that is mold and mildew resistant, and we used a flame retardant additive that gives it a Class A fire rating. If the paint is exposed to fire, it will char and create a protective barrier that prevents the wood from catching on fire.

Sarah painting

Because we’re planning to stain and seal the concrete, we wanted to do the painting before the floor was poured. The paint sprayer has a way of coating everything in a mist of paint that wouldn’t be fun to remove and it’s a large space to put down drop cloths. It was a good thing we did because the flame retardant makes the paint thinner than usual, and when we started spraying the paint dripped off the rough sawn lumber rather than soaking in. We discovered that a roller works a lot better than the sprayer to get the paint worked into the wood, but even so it was going to take more than one coat and the roller was way too slow.

Slow progress

First coat with sprayer

In Progress

Second sprayer coat

We went back to using the paint sprayer, but in light passes. Even so, it went through five gallon buckets of paint fast. It took three coats to get to an acceptable level, and we went through fifteen gallons of paint in the process. After all of that, there are still places where the dark wood peeks through and other spots where the wood stained the paint yellow. Ultimately, it’s a basement. Nearly all of this will be covered up by the drop ceiling when we eventually finish it, and it’s a big improvement over how it looked before.

First Floor Stair Opening

May 26, 2014 / Matt / 0 Comments

My friend Dean came back last Saturday to help me work on the house. We spent some time sorting through my scrap metal pile, getting all the copper, brass, and aluminum separated and pondering what to do with the remaining near-worthless steel and iron. Then we started work on framing the opening for the first floor stairs.

Planned stair opening (not actually green)

The new stairs will be several feet further back in the house to increase the front bedroom size (currently 8′ x 7½’). This means the existing opening between the first and second floor needs to move. In addition, because we’re adding steps to the attic, the opening will change shape, from an L to a rectangle. One advantage of this design is we can put a solar tube in the roof above the stairs and a light well will allow natural light all the way down to the first floor.

Dean putting up the wall

After adding some blocking from below between the first floor joists to bear the wall, we put down a sill plate board and used the laser level to position a sistered double joist directly above it. Getting the joists into position proved the most difficult part of the process. We were able to frame the wall on the floor and tip it into place. The laser level proved accurate: once it was aligned on the sill and joist, the wall was perfectly plumb.

First sistered joist on opposite side

Sunday I positioned the sistered double joist on the other side of the stair opening. This set the boundaries of what need to be removed and what needs to be filled in. Last year when we demoed the old stairs, we also demoed the middle bedroom we were using as an office so that we could make way for the new stairs. Last December we filled the room back up with debris from the attic, so Monday evening I cleared it all out, dropping the boards straight down into the basement and then piling them for later use. Tuesday evening I pulled up the hardwood floor (which was good enough to come up in sections still attached to the furring) and the subfloor.

Dean sistering joists

Sunday morning Dean returned, bringing his old but compact jigsaw which fit between the floor joists. This allowed me to cut out the joists over the new stairwell and give them to Dean, who put them back up over the old stairwell, sistered to the existing partial joists. Then I put in a new joist down the length of the opening directly above and flush with the beam.

Opening finished

Once again, we’re very grateful to Dean for his assistance! This felt like a big step forward toward getting the stairs in and the first floor framed out. It’s pretty amazing how big the space is. On one hand it feels like a bit of a waste, since we’re losing almost a hundred square feet out of the second floor, but in exchange we’ll get two bedrooms in the attic, so I think it’s a worthwhile trade.

Learning Lessons

March 21, 2014 / Matt / 2 Comments

It goes without saying that in a project like this, having never done anything like it before, that we’re going to make mistakes. As they say, the important thing about making mistakes is what we learn from them. I’m trying to learn from what we’ve done so far, both to help inform us on how to do things in the future, but also just as advice to anyone thinking about doing the same types of things.

Fortunately, most of the things that I would do differently have been small: I would use the “Q” column caps with the “SDS” screws for the LVL beam so I didn’t have the stupid through-bolts sticking out. Drilling those bolt holes was an unbelievable pain and furring and drywalling over them will suck. I would have checked for square when re-framing the bay, and done the rigid foam around the bay differently, since I’m not thrilled with the angled corners. However, these are small enough things that I don’t worry about them too much.

The damn subfloor, though. No project has offered so much “learning” as this. If I could go back in time, the steel beam in the basement needed to be about ¾” higher than we put it. When I was jacking up the old beam, I ran into a lot of resistance trying to get it any higher so I made it level where it was. If we had gotten it up a bit higher, the whole joist leveling project would have been considerably easier. Failing that, I needed to shim under all of the joists at the beam (Method 3). I should have held off making the stair opening down to the basement until the leveling was done. I should have brought all of the OSB in right away instead of letting it sit outside under a tarp all winter.

OSB in the snow

I needed to plan out the subfloor courses first, since the joists aren’t exactly 16″ on center. I needed to put down chalk lines for each course instead of assuming the outside wall was reasonably straight, or at least use the laser. I should have taken up all of the old floor right away, instead of a section at a time. That way I could have repositioned the joists that were just a bit off in the middle by using blocking. I should have checked the joists for being out of square, so I could plane down high edges.

I should have ripped the tongue off the first course and left the groove exposed instead of putting the groove against the wall and leaving the tongue exposed. Jamming the groove over the tongue when it’s already screwed down is a bad way to do it. I needed to put glue into the groove before putting the next panel in.

Subfloor

More than anything else, though, I should have hired it out. It would have cost thousands of dollars, but it would be finished by now, probably a couple of months ago. Instead the subfloor isn’t finished, it’s not done as well as it could have been, and most likely we won’t finish the first floor this year as a result. Well, lesson learned. I’ll definitely be hiring out some things going forward to try and get this project back on track.

Bay Leveling

February 27, 2014 / Matt / 3 Comments

Removing floor boards

The pre-subfloor leveling isn’t quite done yet, and the bay window on the front of the house brought its own set of challenges. For starters, the joist running across the very front of the house (and across the widest part of the bay) is embedded in brick, meaning I couldn’t jack it up the way I did most of the others. There’s also a gap of nearly two feet between that joist and the joist in the center of the bay, which is considerably wider than the 16″ that most of the joists are spaced. Finally, the old floorboards rested directly on top of the brick foundation and extended under the bay walls, whereas in most of the balloon-framed house, it only reaches the edge of the wall.

Level? ish?

When we rebuilt the bay windows, I noticed the floorboard situation and debated replacing it then, but between doing only one window at a time and the corner studs not being replaced, I decided against it. That meant the first step was to use an oscillating multi tool to cut the floorboards back at the wall edge. Then I glued shims to the top of the existing joists and added some blocking joists to better support the gap between joists.

Shimmed, Reinforced, Re-mortared

Questions sprang to mind of how to control air and vapor infiltration through the foundation and through the gaps in the wood, and how to insulate the bay properly. We’ll be spray-foaming the cavities in the wall, and on the sides of the house we’ll spray foam the top of the foundation wall to air seal it to the wood, but here that isn’t an option because the brick comes all the way up to the underside of the floor. The exterior rigid insulation doesn’t help either because it doesn’t extend over the brick.

Front shim and spray foam

I decided to attach an inch-thick shim to the inside edge of the brick wall (on top of sill gasket) that will support the subfloor. In front of the shim, and along the top of the brick on the sides of the bay, we’ll fill with spray foam. I’ll also glue the outside edges of the subfloor to the framing to further seal everything. Hopefully that will be sufficient, since it will be damn difficult to do anything about it with the subfloor in place.

When I initially test fit the shim I realized that the brick was —perhaps unsurprisingly— uneven. In order to properly support the shim I had to mix up some mortar and straighten out the top of the foundation. That meant waiting a couple of days for the mortar to set up, but then I was able to drill some holes into the brick and secure the shim with Tapcon screws.

First piece of OSB

I went through a few cans of “big gap” Great Stuff, since the real spray foam won’t be for a bit. Fortunately it’s so cold that it cures slowly, giving me ample time to even it out. I got the first of three pieces of OSB down that go into the bay. I took my time and worked out the dimensions exactly, accounting for all of the unevenness of the studs. There’s still a small gap along the edge of the angle, but I’ll fill that with caulk. The important part is it’s secure, level, and insulated. I’m considering whether I should exchange the one piece of blocking in the center with two, since that would be a more proper 16″ spacing, plus there’s a good chance I’ll wind up putting an electrical outlet in the floor there. One of the reasons to use screws instead of nails is you can change your mind without too much hassle.

Subfloor Frustrations

February 13, 2014 / Matt / 0 Comments

Leveling joists

I spent nearly all of this past weekend leveling the joists in the first floor. That effort was largely successful, with the nine remaining 12′ spans all adjusted to within a sixteenth of an inch using Method 3. I also leveled five other joists that required the tapered shimming method and got a few more sheets glued and screwed down. My hope, and in fact my expectation was that having done that I would then be able to start putting down full, 8′ sheets of OSB, allowing me to finally finish up this project.

Using the shimming method

Unfortunately, that hasn’t happened. In addition to not being level, the joists are not evenly spaced. They employ a generous “sixteen” inches on center alignment that means the 8′ sheets don’t line up in the middle of a joist at either end, sometimes coming short of one joist entirely. I tried planning ahead, measuring out to the next sheet and seeing if I could make one sheet stretch, but it just didn’t work. Instead I’m finding myself cutting sheets at roughly 32″, 48″, or 64″, plus or minus an inch or so.

Slow progress

On top of this, I’m finding that the walls aren’t exactly even either, so that I’m having difficulty getting the panels to align evenly down a joist and one panel to the next. After putting down an 8′ panel that left a gap at one corner and was snug at the other, I decided I needed to do better. As a result, instead of cutting my panels square at say 48″, I cut an edge that tapers back a ½” or so from the tongue to the groove, so that panels meet in the center of the joist and the tongues fits snugly into the grooves. This is precise and thus time consuming work. Tonight I spent two hours putting two small panels down, incrementally increasing the completed area by a whopping thirty-six square feet.

Cutting tapered ends

When I finished carefully scribing, cutting, and fitting the second of these panels I discovered that the joist was torqued and the shim I glued down was sticking up on the exposed side. Because of this, the second panel is raised up higher than the first. It’s a slight difference, but after the inordinate amount of time I’m spending to make everything level, it’s extremely frustrating. I’ll probably have to go back around with the power planer and even at least a few seams.

Argh! Not even!

I keep reminding myself how I wanted to hire this project out, and thinking I really should have done that, high cost or no. At this point it’s starting to feel like it would have been worth it, assuming they would have done as good a job. It’s hard to even estimate at this point how long it will take me to finish. I’d like to think I’ve figured out my methods now and it should go faster, but who knows. The bay will bring its own set of challenges and I still have some of the shorter joist spans to level. After that I need to fill in the narrow, 5″ gap all along the North wall. Needless to say, I’m really looking forward to this project being done.

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