Tag: tongue and groove

Second Stair Run

August 26, 2014 / / 1 Comment
First stringer

First stringer

With the first run of stairs done and the landing subfloor in place, the next step in the stair project is to build the second run from the landing up to the second floor. This went more smoothly than the first run, partly because I had done it before, partly because I knew going in that the landing wasn’t square, and mostly because it was a shorter run.

Sarah installing risers and treads

Sarah installing risers and treads

I used the laser level to establish distance from the beam and height to the last step. The joist above the beam forms the last step of the stairs, so the stringers rest against it. The stringers also straddle the edge of the landing so that the first step is far enough forward that when the second floor landing is built there will be enough head room. Since I also put down a 2×4 as a kick plate for the stringers, I wound up cutting a zig-zag pattern at the stringer bottoms. As before, I sistered 2x4s to the stringers for added strength, but because these stringers are only 9½” instead of 14″ thick, I had to cut the edge of the 2x4s back slightly to fit against the kick plate.

Tread and riser connection

Tread and riser connection

I cut the treads and risers slightly differently than the first run. I still cut the tongue and groove at the back of the tread so it locks into the riser, but rather than simply having the riser stick up ¼” high at the front and notch the leading edge of the tread, I used the same type of tongue and groove that I used at the back, so the tread actually locks onto the top of the riser. Not only does this fit more snugly, I didn’t have to swap blades on my dado and cut different sizes. In hindsight I should have done that for the first run, but it’s fine. Sarah glued and screwed the risers and treads into place, so all that’s left is to open up the doorway at the top of the stairs and add a temporary railing and door.

Risers and Treads

August 20, 2014 / / 2 Comments
Grooved riser (with glue)

Grooved riser (with glue)

It’s time for something more positive. This part of the stair project went extremely well. In fact, the only thing I had a problem with was the glue getting everywhere, including on my screw gun. The plan is to eventually clad the OSB risers and treads with hardwood, so there the OSB tread has no nose and it didn’t need to be as thick as a typical tread. Maybe I could have overbuilt it, but I already had a lot of leftover ¾” OSB from the subfloor so I used that. I didn’t want the treads to deflect, or flex at the back when you step on them, so I decided to cut a groove in the risers and a tongue on the treads so they’d lock together. I contemplated using the router, but instead I picked up a dado blade set for the table saw, which is awesome.

Riser and tread interlock

Riser and tread interlock

I first cut all of my treads and risers to width on the table saw with the regular blade, then cut them to length on the miter saw. Then I swapped in the dado blade and cut a ⅜” deep groove in the risers, ⅜” from the bottom edge. Next I cut out the bottom ⅜” of the edge of the treads, again ⅜” wide. The two pieces fit together like a glove. I wasn’t quite done though. I also cut out the bottom ¼” of the treads, ¾” wide, and cut all of my risers ¼” tall. As a result, both the front and the back of the tread locked into place.

Treads and risers installed

Treads and risers installed

With my careful stringer work completed, gluing and screwing down the risers and treads was a fairly quick job. Every once in a while, something goes to plan, and I’m pretty freaking happy about it. Next step is the landing floor.

Basement Stairwell Framing

March 28, 2014 / / 0 Comments

The subfloor is nearly done. I just have to put down a thin, 4″ strip along the North wall. However, before I can finish that up I needed to fix the stair opening to the basement along the outside wall. When Matt B and I framed it last year, we cut back the joist ends along the outside wall. Now, as with all of the other joists, they need to be at the right level. I took a look at it and decided it would be easier to pull out the joist ends and redo them.

Stair opening

Stair opening (also pictured: giant rack of old floor boards in basement)

I first tried cutting the joist ends down to the right size, but they were not in great shape, and a couple of them broke in half. I tried cutting some new pieces but nominal 2x10s are too loose in the rough sawn notches and I couldn’t position them as accurately as I wanted. In addition, I decided I wanted some sort of bracing down the length. A full 2×10 would close up the cavity and prevent it from being spray-foamed. Notching a 2×4 into the ends would work, but would be a real pain.

Instead I decided to just put new 2x4s (planed a few times) on top of the rim on the other side of the wall studs, screw a 2×4 onto the face, and then for good measure, shore it up with some support blocking glued and screwed underneath.

New framing, start of subfloor

New framing, start of subfloor

With the new structure built, I started working on covering it in subfloor. I wanted the OSB to span the opening, which required some fancy carpentry. The narrow section along the wall needed a groove because the rest of the subfloor is tongue and groove. I’ve been cutting my own grooves out of my leftovers on the table saw instead of wasting full panels. The problem here is that the piece is shaped like an ‘L’, so cutting the groove on the inside edge was complicated by the fact that I couldn’t slide it all the way across the table saw.

I started by cutting the groove as far as I could on the table saw, which left about a foot or so. Then I used my circular saw to get closer, leaving about 4″. Finally I used my oscillating tool to cut the sides of the groove and a wood chisel to finish it up. The piece slid in and fit like a glove, tying this section in with the rest of the subfloor. Once I finish this edge, I just need to plane and glue some seams and this project will finally be done!

Learning Lessons

March 21, 2014 / / 2 Comments

It goes without saying that in a project like this, having never done anything like it before, that we’re going to make mistakes. As they say, the important thing about making mistakes is what we learn from them. I’m trying to learn from what we’ve done so far, both to help inform us on how to do things in the future, but also just as advice to anyone thinking about doing the same types of things.

Fortunately, most of the things that I would do differently have been small: I would use the “Q” column caps with the “SDS” screws for the LVL beam so I didn’t have the stupid through-bolts sticking out. Drilling those bolt holes was an unbelievable pain and furring and drywalling over them will suck. I would have checked for square when re-framing the bay, and done the rigid foam around the bay differently, since I’m not thrilled with the angled corners. However, these are small enough things that I don’t worry about them too much.

The damn subfloor, though. No project has offered so much “learning” as this. If I could go back in time, the steel beam in the basement needed to be about ¾” higher than we put it. When I was jacking up the old beam, I ran into a lot of resistance trying to get it any higher so I made it level where it was. If we had gotten it up a bit higher, the whole joist leveling project would have been considerably easier. Failing that, I needed to shim under all of the joists at the beam (Method 3). I should have held off making the stair opening down to the basement until the leveling was done. I should have brought all of the OSB in right away instead of letting it sit outside under a tarp all winter.

OSB in the snow

OSB in the snow

I needed to plan out the subfloor courses first, since the joists aren’t exactly 16″ on center. I needed to put down chalk lines for each course instead of assuming the outside wall was reasonably straight, or at least use the laser. I should have taken up all of the old floor right away, instead of a section at a time. That way I could have repositioned the joists that were just a bit off in the middle by using blocking. I should have checked the joists for being out of square, so I could plane down high edges.

I should have ripped the tongue off the first course and left the groove exposed instead of putting the groove against the wall and leaving the tongue exposed. Jamming the groove over the tongue when it’s already screwed down is a bad way to do it.  I needed to put glue into the groove before putting the next panel in.

Slow progress

Subfloor

More than anything else, though, I should have hired it out. It would have cost thousands of dollars, but it would be finished by now, probably a couple of months ago. Instead the subfloor isn’t finished, it’s not done as well as it could have been, and most likely we won’t finish the first floor this year as a result. Well, lesson learned. I’ll definitely be hiring out some things going forward to try and get this project back on track.